theworldofdreams.com

http://www.theworldofdreams.com/phpBB2/ ... php?t=5862

For those of you interested on the grossly over-rated concept of 'free speech' and other pleasantries of conversation and human nature and interaction, I refer you to this lovely (but obviously under-used) resource I took many an hour to compile to avert this very thing.

It is truly ironic that 'free speech' cannot exist without guidelines. But then, neither can society. I consider myself grateful that while the people here in WoD sometimes feel it neccessary to argue, they are, on the whole, intelligent people who can grasp the simple structure of what is a 'good' conversation and what is not.

Childish bickering is my day job. I don't need to put up with it on the forums. Regardless of whether Celeste's post was 'appropriate' or not is not for us to decide, nor can (or should) we judge her character in this regard. Admittedly, yes, it is very difficult, sometimes, but I do not care for abuse at all. Time and time again I've had to address the issue of 'free speech' and I put it as succinctly as I can right now.

Free speech is not free abuse.

http://www.theworldofdreams.com/phpBB2/ ... php?t=5862

I urge you, if you have not read this, to read it. If you have, read it again. It's common sense and I've not had a soul argue against it, which means it's fair. It's a *subtle* hint how many times the SAME link is on this post, no an error.

http://www.theworldofdreams.com/phpBB2/ ... php?t=5862

- Marius the Teacher
"Everyone, hands on heads!"

I quite agree, Marius. A wonderful post and I think I should slip it into the Manual somewhere.

Regardless, people are inperfect humans who often will REact rather than take a few moments to calm down and consider what appears to be an offending post objectively. I maintain that is not necessarily a bad thing, it is just being human.

If all of us agreed with one another or so carefully phrased our words so no one could possibly take offense, there would be no meat, no heat, no humanness in it. Without that inherent humanity there would be no humor for how could we be assured that no one would take offense at it? Without that personal touch, how could we dare to express an opinion at all?

I realize the preceding might appear to be an exaggeration but I am all for us humans reveling in the glories and tragedies of our natures. We are angelic beasts.

It takes two to start an argument, and it's the second reply that exacerbates the situation. However, the first person is not without fault, either, especially if he or she has a long history of getting involved in flame-wars. I think EVERYBODY stands to learn from Marius' guidelines. Next time your posts are loaded with unnecessary sarcasm or some form of indirect inflammatory remark, think twice before you click submit. If you just know that your post is going to create controversy, why make that post at all? Wouldn't it be better to take a second to rephrase your words in such a way as to not "ruffle" anyone's feathers?

Joram Lionheart wrote:It takes two to start an argument, and it's the second reply that exacerbates the situation. However, the first person is not without fault, either, especially if he or she has a long history of getting involved in flame-wars. I think EVERYBODY stands to learn from Marius' guidelines. Next time your posts are loaded with unnecessary sarcasm or some form of indirect inflammatory remark, think twice before you click submit. If you just know that your post is going to create controversy, why make that post at all? Wouldn't it be better to take a second to rephrase your words in such a way as to not "ruffle" anyone's feathers?

You got feathers?

I quite agree with you and Marius even though I imagine my responses might indicate otherwise. I also feel people get too bent out of shape if someone says something that isn't dripping in saccharine.

Note to Laephis: We aren't bickering now, we are just discussing stuff. To keep things more in-topic for this particular forum, Joram, got anything you wanna trade?

Bayn wrote:To keep things more in-topic for this particular forum, Joram, got anything you wanna trade?

How much are you paying for your local phone service? I bet I can get you a better deal . . .

Joram Lionheart wrote:

Bayn wrote:To keep things more in-topic for this particular forum, Joram, got anything you wanna trade?

How much are you paying for your local phone service? I bet I can get you a better deal . . .

I doubt it! I am with Opex...oh wait, you said local phone service. My normal long distance bill is $2.19 per month.

Why should we judge somone on past errors? Do we not live in a time where people are allowed/expected to make mistakes. Furthermore is it not right to forgive and forget?

Aran Dragonblood wrote:Why should we judge somone on past errors?

How else would you judge someone if not by their actions (words in this case)--good and bad? A judge will allow a DUI violator to get off with a slap on the wrist only so many times, and then he/she'll sentence him/her to do hard time or pay a hefty fine (or both).
History has a lot to teach us. A person's past errors--like his/her successes--can tell us a lot about that person.

Do we not live in a time where people are allowed/expected to make mistakes.

We also live at a time when people are fully expected to take responsibility for their actions. No, you can't blame it on someone else. No one is forcing you to post on these msg boards. You decided to post, and you chose the kind of words to express yourself (I'm obviously using the generic "you" here).

Furthermore is it not right to forgive and forget?

Just because I choose to forgive you for hitting me on the face, doesn't mean I'll forget to duck next time you raise your hand.
Forgiving is easy. Forgetting is much harder, especially if you keep repeating your past offenses.

Bayn Wrote:
Regardless, people are inperfect humans

hey i resent that remark i am too perfect

Bayn,

I agree with you. We do not need to lose the 'humanness' to our posts. The passion and the wit and the drama and everything else can all exist: what I desire to see less of is petty bickering about issues and people over nothing.

It is certainly fruitful and very rewarding to have intelligent conversation. I disagree with the point that if we remain rational, we are less human. To have respect for others and to post with that consideration, I would think, is one of the highest *human* behaviours to try for. To be rude, self-centered, arrogant and ignorant is easy - we are all victims of acting this way from time to time.

However, if we can all try to get along, and remain faithful to the issues raised, and the content in question, and not squabbling and arguing and resorting to "I know you are, so what am I?" routines of argument, we'll all find the shard is a better place.

-M

And then Gwardosa got his deamon bones and everyone was happy cause there was no more need to post here

The end

OOOOOHHHHHH so this was all just about getting some stinking Deamon bones? yeah right!!! I pushed buttons dangit! meant to do it! I LOVE PUSHING BUTTONS!!!!!!
You must all admit I got a good three pages out of it.
Now to my main point. I pushed buttons to simply get a run on thread and to poke at someone who almost always sends a negative vibe when posting, be it on purpose, or accidental due to some flaw in her thought pattern.
I admit I am slightly annoyed at her for previous posts, and while I think Marrius has several points none of them apply to me. I think on my own, follow my own drummer and such, often he has no sense of rythym mind you, but hey the poor guy works for free. I leave you with this thought, FLAMES ROCK! Grow flame retardant skin or learn from your mistakes.

How very dissapointing.

-M

You're starting to sound like Simon, Azzo.

Aran Dragonblood wrote:Why should we judge somone on past errors? Do we not live in a time where people are allowed/expected to make mistakes. Furthermore is it not right to forgive and forget?

because it's all we have to go on in predicting how people will act in the future. mistakes happen often enough but if you merely tolerate mistakes there is little impetus for the person making them to improve is there. a person can forgive but it is unwise to forget imho. people must be held accountable for their actions otherwise society breaks down quickly into a dog eat dog environment devoid of civility. certainly everyone can have an off minute or day and shouldn't be hung out to dry for it necessarily. on the other hand a person who is consistently rude or inconsiderate should be publically spanked from time to time in hopes they will smarten up. this comment is not aimed at anyone in particular btw.

i miss the days when you could call someone out for misbehaviour and kill them. people were a damnsight more polite when there were serious consequences for their actions.