theworldofdreams.com

I had to give this alot of thought before I posted this and if this is the wrong place feel free to move it to the appropriate place. Beforehand I will say this is not intended to flame any one person or a group for that matter. This is all strictly me relaying to you what i have seen from people in this quest so far as roleplaying or the lack of it, following quest etiquette or not following it and respect for other players and actually working as a team within in the quest. Unfortunately alot of the good qualities seem to be missing from this quest and alot of the bad ones sadly apparent. We have a self made position I like to call the runner. He runs ahead of everyone else like he's in god mode and brings back a mob that attacks everyone but him. In return he or she has inadvertently killed off some quest mates. This *runner* will repeatedly do this throughout the entire part of the quest despite people's request to stop. He loots yet doesn't kill a single thing on the quest except his own questmates. How i would have loved to freeze such a person. Then you have the **I've died too many times so i'm keeping my loot* person. Understandeable because the *runner* won't stay still and keeps dragging up mobs and bringing them back to the fighters and mages. I am not saying they are in the wrong but one action begats another and destroys the whole purpose of the quest. Then there is the free form looter and what i am going to depict in words next I have actually seen. Let me reiterate that everything I am depicting here I have seen. They join a quest and start looting despite the fact that there are designated looters in place already. These are the ones who show up halfway through a quest. Then you will find at the loot split that these people are conveniently absent. So the end result is this is seen being done and it turns into a big free for all as far as looting goes. In my opinion the loot is there and should be a fair amount of loot as far as quest goes. But unfortunately not everyone is honest and when a bunch of people storm a quest midway through it you lose track of who is doing what. So if you feel the loot is inadequate and can't understand why take a step back or a few steps if needed and observe what is going on with people in the quest. You may find your answer there. But this i can tell you it's not the fault of the gms or seers.

I say we just E-bolt the runners next time.

Zareena wrote: So to insinuate that he would he would go on a quest for the loot is absolutely absurd. .

You do not understand, do you?

ShadowStone wrote:I say we just E-bolt the runners next time.

I second that, seriously too, next time I see someone run too far ahead and bring stuff back ill will e bolt you.

Maybe most of you don't remember, but when I played...

-I remember when there were no such things as "Looters" because we just trusted one another, and who the heck cared if we didn't split the loot?

-I remember when the most important thing on a quest was that we worked together

-I remember when we sang the praises of our fellow players after quests, just because we were proud to be associated with them

-I remember when participating in a quest was a True Event, no matter how often they happened

-I remember when we kept track of our history, because it was our history

Sebastian wrote:Maybe most of you don't remember, but when I played...

-I remember when there were no such things as "Looters" because we just trusted one another, and who the heck cared if we didn't split the loot?

-I remember when the most important thing on a quest was that we worked together

-I remember when we sang the praises of our fellow players after quests, just because we were proud to be associated with them

-I remember when participating in a quest was a True Event, no matter how often they happened

-I remember when we kept track of our history, because it was our history

I was here then too, and I remember as well. I agree with you completely. The current attitudes with and about questing has alot to do with why I rarely ever do it anymore.

ehb wrote: On one such invasion near despise, there was only a few of us. It took over 7 hrs to beat back the invasion.

It's not a duty, it's a privilege.

Maybe then I should just sit the next few invasions out and just do my own thing.

ehb wrote: When all was done, I myself died approx. 10 times and my death taxes came to 58k+. I was lucky to have enough in my bank box to cover the shortage, after accounting what there was after the split.

You don't hunt often, do you?

I also said I can make 60k to 100k if I wanted or needed to. But who wants to do the same troll bashing (or titam and orge lord) day after day after day. There is other things I enjoy doing as well.

ehb wrote: I get involved in 2 to 3 invasions each day.

You lucky SOB.

So now i'm an SOB? thats alittle insulting isnt it?

ehb wrote: But the fact that people do show up for these invasions, knowing there is little to no loot to be had says something about the players as well.

I'm glad that this is the first time in 4 years someone has complained on these boards that there was a "lack of loot" on a quest. From the bottom of my heart I hope that you and Maddox are alone in feeling this way.

Again, if it was for the loot, I would not even bother with the invasions/quests. I go to help out.

ehb wrote: Your going to see many of the same players at each invasion while others never go to help out.

And now I know why they don't join every quest. Pfft.[/quote]

Well maybe its time I stop going to every invasion when i'm logged on as well.


I have never said I go for loot. I have never said I didnt enjoy the invasions. But I did say that new players to the shard that does join in, can not always afford the taxes they must pay from their deaths I also agree with Cath that this may also be on part of other players keeping what they loot.

But I have yet to see some special items from these creatures from another time. I know if I went to the past then I would have some future type itmes with me Or if I went to the future then the items I have would be old and collectable as they would not be common day items in the future.

But again I do not and have not gone for the loot but to help repel the invasion. But if doing that is a bad attitude on my part then I will sit the next cpl invasions out.

Ok Mages, let me ask a question. How do you propose that we get the Branubians to come out of hiding one at a time? From my experience, it doesn't matter how careful you are. You are going to spawn a multitude of Branubians even going one tile at a time, and end up running for your life because few people are willing to stay back and heal those who are brave enough to step forward.

Zareena wrote:
So to insinuate that he would he would go on a quest for the loot is absolutely absurd. .


You do not understand, do you?

Ummmmmmmm actually I do understand quite well.

Maddox was merely stating the facts of the quest(he was not complaining about the loot,as he said many logged before the end of the quest)and a statement he made was misunderstood.

And I have to agree with Ehb here,I too find your reply a little insulting.Especially the wonderful way you had to colour it(I am quite able to read I can assure you)

I might be overstepping my bounds here, since I've only been here about two months, but if so, I'm sure I'll hear...errr...read about it.

On the home page, it says....

"The World of Dreams was founded by a group of people dedicated to creating a fun, friendly and enjoyable place to play, and though the shard has since been passed on into other hands, the ideals of the shard have remained the same." (emphasis added by me)

From the layout of the staff page, it looks like Sebastian is the top dog in the administration. I'm always interested in reading posts by admin, because I believe the collective personality of a game is often largely shaped by its leaders--both staff and the most active players--and the examples they set for the rest of the gamers to follow.

In my opinion, some people came down on Maddox way too harshly. I work at an international company, with people who learned English as a second language. Maddox said English is his third language, so I have no trouble at all believing that he meant no disrespect about the loot, especially since he ended his post by thanking those who participated and saying it was a fight worth fighting. The people I work with who had to learn English as a second language, often word things in a way that makes them sound overly blunt and sometimes even rude. They don't mean it that way, and I believe Maddox didn't mean it that way either.

I do, however, think it's rude to make fun of someone who can't word things perfectly (especially after they explain that English is not their native tongue) and to threaten to punish an entire group of people for the perceived wrong-doing of one person. In my opinion, that does not set a very good example for the rest of the players to follow. But again, I'm still new here, still learning the do's and don't's of this "community," and still developing my thoughts and opinions about it.

Avyn

I really dont understand this tone of the discussion on these forums.

First it was about etiquette and working together, then this discussion about loot.

The discussion on these forums should be just as friendly as this shard is and opinions should be free.

I dont think there is a single people on this shard who joins the quests for loot?

At least I join them for excitement, and because quests are the "story" of the shard that I wanna follow. Be part of it when something happens. I know Maddox's reason for questing is exactly the same. Maddox usually passes the loot splits totally anyways so loot cannot be hes motivator..

I also have english as third language, im desperately seeking the words to express myself and i fail time after time... So I know exactly how frustrating it can be to try to explain something precisely. (there I failed again and had to circle around it)

Im absolutely certain about one thing though, Maddox likes the game, and the quests and team playing... if someone gets different impression, think again!

I think we should keep open mind for peoples thoughts and opinions at least on these forums, and not to slaughter them if they dare to post something that isnt exactly what you had in mind.

and finally...

I would like to thank the Seer(s?) for making this current major invasion by Branubians and Shaboolis. Its been a tough fight! =)

I cannot wait to see the final battle!

-Daalia-

nevermind it doesn't matter

Eventhia Leir wrote:Ok Mages, let me ask a question. How do you propose that we get the Branubians to come out of hiding one at a time? From my experience, it doesn't matter how careful you are. You are going to spawn a multitude of Branubians even going one tile at a time, and end up running for your life because few people are willing to stay back and heal those who are brave enough to step forward.

There are many ways to do this, one way is to ASSIGN a person, ONE person, who is responsible and CAPABLE to be the one to bring the hiders out. Notice the highighted words, ASSIGN, ONE, CAPABLE. Those words are not used lightly, they are used to emphasize the team and each person in the team utilizing their abilities to their utmost.

Someone HAS to be in charge, or everything will fall apart. When i say fall apart, I do not mean that you will not be able to complete the quest, quests can be completed by anyone with any amount of idiocy involved. Fall apart means, you will have multiple (I believe the quote here is 10) deaths during the quest. Ask some of the people that have quested with me in the past, before I stopped questing, how many times do I die, or the people that I am "grouped" with? The answer is a resounding none, or possibly one, and that one would come on some of the HARDEST quests that have been out there.

ok, Back on track, you want to know how to keep people alive? Group Tactics for the 5 millionth time, ASSIGN people to work in small groups, 1 mage should be able to support 2-4 other players depending on their abilities. Assign 2 mages to heal the person ASSIGNED by the LEADER to go ahead and draw out the enemy. When that person comes back, DO NOT RUN through the "group" stop towards the front, if you are poisoned, talk, "say, you know i'm poisoned, perhaps you could cure me" it is MUCH MUCH MUCH easier to target on the speech of a compatriot, than to try and bring their bar up during combat in certain situations. The reason he has 2 mages, is he will be taking most of the damage for the beginning phases of the combat. As he settles in, have your VGs taunt off some stuff, to the individual "sub-groups". After all of the creatures are killed, DO NOT RUN FORWARD. DO NOT RUN AROUND LIKE A CHICKEN WITH YOUR HEAD CUT OFF. Wait for the mages to recoup mana, and have the ASSIGNED, CAPABLE point man, go bring some more back.

Now onto pets and henchmen, don't bring them. they help you out fine when its you and your friends, but in the larger groupings of quests, they just get in the way, even the "archer" henchmen.


There in a nutshell is what you need to do to make the next invasion a fun and LIVING experience.

If there is anyone around who went on one of the first Vampire quests, when I was the group leader, how many people died and how many people ran ahead? None, there was not one death, we had about 15-20 players, and every one that was there took their own role seriously, and did not just run around. Everyone had an assigned job, and everyone performed their job.

Any further questions?

Yesterday afternoon, a group of heroes decided to clear the Branubians around Despise. This group included Edison, Ciara, Pau, Angelica, Shadowstone (arrived late but always welcome), Pedro etc etc etc.

To answer the question raised about HOW to do this, read what Felix wrote. That is what we did. We had a point tank. His job (and his alone) was to go forward, one step at a time, until he triggered the hiding Branubians, and he then retreated. It wasn't rushing ahead; it was careful movements that the rest of the group was prepared for.

We targeted the curs first (because their fire breath wakes up the surrounding Branubians still hiding), then the assassins, the Death Guards, the Beasts etc. Whenever a mage got attacked, it was taunted off. Whenever a warrior got surrounded, he/she was helped. We went slow and took it easy. No one ran ahead and brought back 20 mobs.

We also knew from past encounters at Despise that these guys love to hide on the little island with their snipers and marksmen, so we determined to clear the passage leading to Despise first, then the area in front of the island, then the island.

You know what? It was working. It was working GREAT right up until a second group showed up behind us and instead of following the path we took, they went directly toward the Despise entrance. This triggered the mobs there and the mobs on the island, and suddenly we had death cries ringing out constantly because our original group was now sandwiched between two attacking forces and the organization that we had worked so hard for fell apart.

There is a reason that you don't see Atei's on most of these quests, and now you know why. Edison tried to convey to people that there is a certain way to be successful on hunts, but he was shouted down. Edison, as anyone who knows him in game will tell you, is not a know-it-all, but he is VERY experienced. He has seen his fair share of good group hunts and bad group hunts, and until the general populace that does quests or any general group hunt understands that running ahead and triggering the mobs is NOT the way to get it done, we will continue to see people dying 8-10 times in a day.

Is this concept so hard to grasp: tanks lead, followed by archers, followed by mages? Tanks taunt the mobs off the mages and archers and buddy-heal one another. The mages main focus is in healing and attack, and the archers target whoever is attacking the hardest to relieve the pressure on both groups. It's called teamwork, folks. It isn't hard to do.

As for the loot statement, I have no doubt Maddox didn't mean that the loot wasn't "good enough," even though it came out that way. He does quests for the thrill of the fight and the advancement of the shard's history, not the gold. I'm sure he was just trying to convey to the folks who had to leave early that they didn't miss much if they didn't get gold.

I'm sorry if this seems rather direct and pointed, but this has been bothering me for a long time. I used to love going on quests just for the sheer fun of doing them. The first time Pau lost everything was on a quest when he couldn't get to where he needed to go and got himself killed by the Praetorians in their now blown-up fort. He had to run as a ghost all the way from the fort to the Trinsic moongate, back to Brit to get rezzed. I remember that quest because it was A QUEST, not a chance to get "phat lewt" or gold.

Maybe quests are happening too frequently? Maybe people are taking them for granted? I don't know about either point, but I do know that the Atei's won't be doing a lot of them. It just isn't fun when all that mayhem breaks out when it doesn't have to. I used to wonder why players like Ciara and Ed and Felix didn't do quests anymore, but now I know.

Finally, and I will get off my soapbox: our staff is the BEST staff, period. Our staff works tirelessly to plan and execute these quests and the ONLY reward they get is seeing the players enjoy themselves and then read about the quests in these forums.

As Ciara reminded me the other day, it's amazing what FREE buys now a days, right?