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I propose that Drocket drop off 20-30 max str points for a mage char, and the same for int on warrior chars. A mage that when buffed has a str of say 40 - 60 would be much more realistic than one with 145 str. the lost points would trickle to the other areas where they would make a lot more sense.
The additional str. for a warrior would enhance his damage, and the int. would play into mana for a mage.

Next point of contention is weight. How about adding the weight restrictions back in relation to stamina. I carry somewhere between 3200 and 5500 stone at any given time. Gramps has seen the upper end of 8k stone. There is more of a chance of spotting an elf than there is any one being able to tote 3k stone even if it were 3 tiles.
These ideas are just tossed in there to see what you think, if you like it say so, if not say so. It is highly unlikely you will hurt my feelings.

Azzo Ranar wrote:I propose that Drocket drop off 20-30 max str points for a mage char, and the same for int on warrior chars. A mage that when buffed has a str of say 40 - 60 would be much more realistic than one with 145 str. the lost points would trickle to the other areas where they would make a lot more sense.

So a mage would only have 40-60 hit points? That would make for a lot of nasty 1-hit kills from stronger mobs and seer-spawned critters. We would need to do something to offset that chance then. And no, I don't think running around wildly is a valid answer Something to reduce the damage taken to mages. Perhaps Modify the Reactive Armor spell to only work on clothes, leather, studded, and bone and have it actually reduce the damage taken for a certain amount of time or damage. The point to limiting it to certain types of armor is so tanks can't utilize it.

Azzo Ranar wrote:Next point of contention is weight. How about adding the weight restrictions back in relation to stamina.

I like this idea. The majority of weight comes from regs, weapons, and all that phat l3wt. This would encourage people to carry less and have to make more frequent town visits. I know my mage Eis always carries 1000-1500 regs each on her, and I think Azzo carries a lot more than that. As for Ehran, God knows what he carries on him to reach his weight of 7000 stones or so. Maybe it's actual stones...but I digress. This would make for a much more realistic fighting environment. One way to offset this is to reduce the amount of treasure mobs carry and increase the amount you can sell it for, or just don't increase the amount because gold falls like water around here anyways.
Well that's enough rambling for me for now.

I actualy meant 40 to 60 base max str. Meaning after buffs estimated as such, int-12 to 18, bless, 14 to 18, would put a mage up to around 64 to 96. Yes one hit kills would be possible, but that is just the point. Mages are not known as big brutish BMF's. We calmly speak a word of power and watch you writhe in agony from however far away our spell range allows.
If you are ignorant enough to run up into a fight with a troll cheiftan then you deserve to be laying on the floor. On the other hand, your summoned friends can take up a front line pose to keep you from being worm food. As far as casters, well lets think here, aren't you a caster and should have some idea how to deal with yourself. Reflect is extremely important, and again, send a casting friend to attack the enemy thereby dropping his reflect so you can snatch his mana, or his friends mana.

Azzo Ranar wrote:I propose that Drocket drop off 20-30 max str points for a mage char, and the same for int on warrior chars. A mage that when buffed has a str of say 40 - 60 would be much more realistic than one with 145 str. the lost points would trickle to the other areas where they would make a lot more sense.

Having a mages hp cap out someplace around 100 would probably be the most reasonable idea. If nothing else exploding chests can do upwards of 90 points of damage.

Next point of contention is weight.*snippage*

Actually I've considered posting suggesting this a few times myself, but to be perfectly honest was afraid to.

It does take a LOT of getting used to, I had to get used to this on the other shards I've been trying out, having your max weight capacity drop from infinity* to 400ish takes a fair bit of getting used to. Initially its annoying as heck but it does actually add to gameplay in the form of takeit or donttakeit decisions.

.grab would also require some changes, it would pretty much need to change from vaccume-everything-in-range, to something more selectable, some checkboxes someplace, gold *check*, regents *check* magicitems *check*.

*ok ok, it's actually 30k or 60k or something I think, but that didn't sound as good in the sentance.

Azzo Ranar wrote:I propose that Drocket drop off 20-30 max str points for a mage char, and the same for int on warrior chars. A mage that when buffed has a str of say 40 - 60 would be much more realistic than one with 145 str. the lost points would trickle to the other areas where they would make a lot more sense.
The additional str. for a warrior would enhance his damage, and the int. would play into mana for a mage.

Next point of contention is weight. How about adding the weight restrictions back in relation to stamina. I carry somewhere between 3200 and 5500 stone at any given time. Gramps has seen the upper end of 8k stone. There is more of a chance of spotting an elf than there is any one being able to tote 3k stone even if it were 3 tiles.
These ideas are just tossed in there to see what you think, if you like it say so, if not say so. It is highly unlikely you will hurt my feelings.

NOOOOOoooOOOOooooOOOOOooo!!!!!!!

That would make my characters UNPLAYABLE!!!!

It would just lead to everyone having a pack mule. That’s all it would do. As far as lowering a mage's STR, it would in effect make mages nothing more then a healer for group hunts. If tanks had higher STR they wouldn't need a mage to heal, they could just stand there and take it. Of course the amount of damage mobs do could be increased, but all spells would have to do more damage to counter that. Which I'm guessing is far more work then drocket cares to do.

In the end what good would all them changes do, make things a little more real? We shouldn’t strive for realism but rather strive for practical game play that is fun for all.

I would love to have a str drop for an int increase as a pure mage, if that's what you're saying?

My only ? about this would be:
I have a "mule" character, her main skills are
tinker
magery
blacksmithy
with my tradeskill being carpentry

My guess is she would probably be classified a mage not a tank. If you drop her max str down to 20 or 30 she wont be able to hold the 100+ ingots to make lamps or the 100+ logs to make the carp items ..... this would make using her very difficult. When I started with her she had around 25 str and I couldn't take over a few steps with less than 100 logs on her
OR are you saying that you would take off 20-30 points of their max?

i still have no clue how you ppl get that a mage has way to high str my tanks str is way over what my mage can get plus a intel drop for a tank would isnt a nerf!

not all mages have this over powering buff.

the only ones as mages i see with over powering buffs are necros with 2-3 hour buffs and getting 5-10 more buff points then a mage if ya dont belive me look at the pic posted in the other post it shows clearly necros can get high buffs/stats and need to be fixed where normal mages get no where near what a necro gets

Liche spell, necro version of poly, sacrifices the ar that you would get if you cast poly. And there is also a chance of dying when you try to cast it. (little hazy on the dying though) So there's no real argument for that, as for spectres touch, I can't really comment except for the fact that it's not 2-3 hours, 1hr and 40mins or something like that.

on my tamer when i cast poloy i get one extra point to my ar not much of a big deal


and i have a necro charecter i tester her all morning :> there way overpowered

ok lets take eldrics pic and look at necros compared to a regual pure mage or a tamer etc

looking at a tamer not a pure mage off my buffs
http://dreamwarriors.homestead.com/files/status.JPG
60str +14 dtrength is 74 str
adso 74 + 17 from bless is 91 stradd in
17 from polo is 108

now a necro looking at eldsrics pic of his buffs
http://members.rogers.com/44862/buffs.jpg

60 str +22 str from spectors touch is 82 str
add in 27 str from lich thats 109 str
now for the kicker add in the 17 for the bless thats a grand total of

127 strenght

necros will still have high str no matter what compared to hybrids 20 or so more str

like i pointed out necros buffs are way to high compared to a regular mage
and some might say well tamers have dragons dragons arnt that great and with necros undead spells and summon sprit they equal out but a pure mage that this whole post is about doesnt have a dragon nor can it summon a pile of vampires or liches to fight for it while it stands behind a tree or a fence and cast plauge which is tons better then eq spell

Although I don't personally like the idea. I do think it is a good idea, if that makes any sense. I think that even though this is a virtual world, There should be more of a sense of realism. My Mage/Druid/Necro (pick one) should not be able to take the damage that my tank can take. And the way it is set up now, he actually can take more. Because I can heal myself a lot faster than my tank can. I can do things with my Druid/Tamer that I would never even consider with my tank.

With that said, of course I would like to have higher STR, higher INT, higher DEX. But it definitely would be interesting to have to work a little smarter to stay alive.

I think 60 hps is pushing a bit too far. Maybe if mage spells worked better to prevent "sudden" deaths that'd make things more reasonable. I'd definitely LOVE to have the highest int possible on my mage, but getting killed way more often than my tank just because I couldn't move fast enough doesn't sound very appealing either. I don't really need the str but I'd like to keep some of the hps. How does that sound? Maybe if we could separate the types of damage by basic melee damage and divide magic spells by "elemental damages" (i.e. assign each spell a kind of elemental effect), as opposed to all types of damage affect your hps the same way. That way mage characters, using protective elemental spells, would be far more effective fighting other spellcasters but still ineffective in melee combat.

Azzo Ranar wrote:I propose that Drocket drop off 20-30 max str points for a mage char, and the same for int on warrior chars. A mage that when buffed has a str of say 40 - 60 would be much more realistic than one with 145 str. the lost points would trickle to the other areas where they would make a lot more sense.

Well, if the str/int/dex things were pushed to this extreme, I think we'd essentially wind up with a class-based system, which I really don't want to do. It would definitely make things easier to balance, but would remove a lot of the variability that I think adds to the game.

Next point of contention is weight. How about adding the weight restrictions back in relation to stamina.

This one is purely a POL limitation problem. Currently, there's no way to adjust the strength-to-carrying capacity ratio (which is something like str*4+10, though that's probably not quite right.) That just seems a bit low to me. If I could adjust it, I'd probably put the average carry weight at about 1000 stones or so, which would mean that you'd lost stamina faster as you approached 2000, and anything above that would be virtually uncarryable. As I said, though, this isn't something that POL currently allows to be changed, though maybe someday it will...

You have been warned.

Drocket wrote:You have been warned.

*hears an ominous bell tone* Woah..was that supposed to happen?